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It’s a lesson that too many have forgotten.
Probably a lesson never taught. A recent military recruiting ad says ” I will obey the orders of my superiors.” It use to be taught to obey the lawful orders of your superiors.
I have discussed this subject with several former and retired US military men. It bothers me to say this, but they ALL told me that no, a soldier should never disobey an order, even one that was illegal. They told me that a soldier should obey the order first, and then file a complaint later if he thought the order was illegal.
Bah! I lost some respect for the former soldiers who told me that… Doesn’t anyone remember Nuremberg?!
A military court ideally should sort out the evidence properly later. It cannot be up to a low level soldier to muck up a military plan if he feels something is wrong, based on feelings and quite obvious illegal acts.
Of course obvious war crimes shouldn’t be obeyed. But other issues like collateral civilian deaths are a gray area best left to the courts later. Even international courts.
Feelings and NOT quite obvious illegal acts (meant to add not).
i was told to drive my track over the edge of a near vertical slope over 200′ in height.
i told the TC “ain’t happening” he said “i’m giving you a direct order” and i replied “i’m giving you a direct refusal. you wanna go over that edge, i’ll get out & watch and take pictures of the wreckage…”
the rest of the crew decided that if the crazy token white boy wasn’t gonna do it, they weren’t going to ride down with the TC either.
when we were all standing there waiting for him to try it, he finally decided maybe it wasn’t a good idea after all.
i disobeyed a few orders, or, at least ignored them.
and i wasn’t the only one during my 20. one needs to be very careful about it though, and the military has no sense of humor on the subject. but yeah, if you give a patently illegal order, or one that’s going to get people killed (in training), you should expect someone to tell you to FOAD. (politely, of course)
the flip side is, if you refuse, you need to be ready to accept the consequences.
Ever since Viet Nam the US military has been aping the WWII German Army. The German Army was over dependence on high technology weapons to atone for their inferior numbers coupled with enemies or perceived enemies on every side.
There were few superior allied ground weapons during WWII, we just had enough slightly inferior weapons that no matter how many Hitler’s forces destroyed, we still had more than enough weapons and men to defeat the Germans facing us on three to five fronts at one time. Now we are taking lessons from the WWII losers. We are building expensive, hard to maintain, and slow to replace weapons. The last two generations of fighter planes is one example and the Sea Wolf sub is another.
I fear that an enemy won’t have to directly oppose these weapons to defeat us. An enemy can out “deploy” them because of the tempo and expense of maintenance coupled with the lag time of replenishment and replacement. Take my word for it, a fried transmission or a blown electronic fire control module can be just as effective as an armor piercing round at knocking out a tank.
Another way to view it is that during WWII we required less than one year to build 6,000 miles of feeder and trunk pipelines from the oil patch to the North East to protect our oil supplies from Hitler’s U-boats. During the past 8 years we have done essentially nothing towards building the Keystone pipeline from Candida to the US Gulf Coast to safeguard our oil supplies. At this rate you’ll only need to stockpile enough guns and ammo to kill your wives and daughters so you can keep them from falling into the enemies’ hands.
If you want to defeat the high-tech US armed forces quickly, it is easily done.
For a chilling view of the consequences, I’d suggest reading William Forstchen’s book “One Second After”. He supposedly based the book on an Air Force study of the effects of an EMP on the military.
High-tech military could be reduced to WW-I era troops in one second. Except they might not have enough horses.
“At this rate you’ll only need to stockpile enough guns and ammo to kill your wives and daughters so you can keep them from falling into the enemies’ hands.”
It’s better to have enough guns and ammo to arm them so they can take down as many as enemies as possible. If a woman can be taught to load a weapon and pull a trigger then let her die fighting beside her husband or father. I’d much rather live with the reality that they were killed in battle than carry the burden of having killed them myself.
Hitler did us a huge favor by disarming the German civilians.
A comment from one of the Chevron protesters shows the real anti-capitalist agenda. These idiots seem to think if coal and oil are curtailed this will force them to come up with some magical clean energy. I’ve never seen people so indoctrinated and blindly accepting whatever that comes from NASA and the oft quoted 97%. That’s all they need to know. That’s all they want to know because they already were anti-capitalist socialists before AGW showed up and they just adopted it because it fits neatly with the “cause.”
“…. the greater question is why is America letting her corporations kill her?”
Hey Gofer, I think a lot of which you are criticis is indeed what is happening. It is just that both traditional conservative s and old school liberals are mistaken about the true nature of our economic system. The system they criticise and you defend is not capitalism. Capitalism is long dead, killed by the same corporate financial elite that are indeed killing America. Our government is utterly corrupt, bought and paid for.
Recently watched a documentary about the Red Mafia and how they were basically running the Soviet Union in the 80’s and after the collapse they started selling everything off. The politicians were all corrupt and the people had to steal just to survive. With all the crony capitalism going on and especially in the “green” sector, I wonder who’s running the show here. The Italian mafia has already inserted itself into “green”.