Raw solar energy is largely worthless for electricity generation, because the sun doesn’t shine much when you need the electricity most – night, winter, and cloudy days. Scientists have been perplexed about finding a way to store solar energy for later use.
But a new discovery has been made by geologists – a way to use stored solar energy for later electricity generation. And it is almost pollution free.
What? No intentionally misleading, darkly silhouetted-against-bright-sky, two stops under-exposed photos of steam rising from the stacks?
You mean like this?
http://tinyurl.com/WPfakeSmoke
Washington Post / AP propaganda:
http://burtonsys.com/climate/WaPo_fakesmoke.jpg
Reality:
http://burtonsys.com/climate/WaPo_fakesmoke_reality.jpg
Bingo! 😀
Dave, BTW I clicked your link. I have bookmarked it. Good job!
Did Alison Coglianese get back with you? Anyone else? (It appears the conversation ended on Fri, Apr 5, 2013 at 3:09 PM.)
I remember that one, Dave. You did an excellent job. The artful, fake stack photos are nothing but propaganda. That and the reporter in front of a cooling tower when they have a pollution story.
Yes, a vein of coal is of greater value than a vein of gold when you are cold!
Andy M posted this yesterday, and it defines “malthusianism”. Not surprising as the presenter’s education was a whole two years of college, and not so much as an Associates Degree…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YYAtSs8W5s
Hey, I have been creating. solar energy storage units for a long time.
I use the old-fashioned method: photosynthesis. Works like a charm and costs little.
Of course, I have to be careful of what the EPA might do to me.
I just helped a neighbor harvest three cords of stored solar power about a week ago, enough to last him all Winter, and it only took two days.
I burned a good bit of stored solar power last night when we had a bonfire. Gotta use up some of that wood before it rots and so I’m having white man fires in my 6′ diameter fire ring this summer when I have the time to have some folks over to enjoy it.
It’s a little chilly, 30 °F and 95% humidity, unusual in arid Colorado but typical for the current upslope conditions. The sun will burn it off later today and it will warm up.
My ex-girlfriend wanted to know if I have any plans to convert some of our stored solar chemical energy and excite the gas molecules in the house into higher vibrational modes. I paraphrased here. It seems she thought I’ve already done it and she was somewhat terse in her inquiry.
Females of the human species are responsible for the majority if global interior warming.
“of” (Cooking again)
What is it with ex-girlfriends? They still like wood, especially when they’re not getting any.
Some like it hot!
“gator69 says:
April 18, 2015 at 3:57 pm
Females of the human species are responsible for the majority if global interior warming.’
Ain’t that the sorry truth! My ex-fiance just doesn’t seem understand no matter how many times I explain it to her. Turning the Thermostat in the house way up will not make it warm faster! Set the damned thing at the temp you want it to be and leave it there. I have also explained what the “comfort zone” is to her several times and that concept also seems to elude her. Thus I probably save money during the winter by keeping my log rack stocked up and using the fireplace even if there is natural gas heated air going up the chimney.
There are times during the winter I come out here to the computer, well away from the fireplace and crack the window next to me to keep from suffering heat prostration.
rah, I’ve observed the same thermostat misconception with my ex-fiancée. I tried to explain it several times over the years but I always recognized that distracted expression telling me I was not getting through because she already knew how it works.
I believe she concluded that thermostats work similar to husbands. When a wife wants something done right away, she turns up the demand level higher than needed to get quicker results and it usually works.
They also seem to understand the function’s behavior at the limits. I noticed she never turns the thermostat all the way up. That, too, is consistent with my hypothesis. Whenever in our 2 ½ decades she turned up the demand intensity all the way up, I retired to my man cave. She must have deduced that a thermostat turned all the way to the limit would shut down the heating for an uncertain period of time.
Rah, surely you’ve heard the old saying, “if it’s got tits or tires, you’ve got trouble.”
I haven’t heard that before, but if it’s got tits, tires, or tracks, I can drive it.
I always admire a man’s can-do attitude but there may be limits. Check the quality of your cooking ingredients but go easy on them …
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01157/portal-graphics-20_1157009a.jpg
http://www.asergeev.com/pictures/archives/2013/1191/jpeg/12.jpg
http://www.abc.net.au/news/image/1828150-3×2-940×627.jpg
Didn’t I explain that I do not waste perfecty good alcohol on cooking? You sound French. 😉
My parents were wine connoisseurs, mainly due to living in Europe twice. I picked up on their tastes, and have discovered some amazing local wineries that I visit on ocassion for restocking. They often take Gold Medals in national tastings, and my parents always enjoyed me bringing down a case or two when I would visit. My mother still has me bring a case with me from a winery just north of my property whenever I visit her, and her friends rave over the quality. In fact, they make a German style apple wine that has pleased the palate of every person to whom I have served it, including those who are not usually fans of wine.
BTW – Nice pic of your mother in law, apparently you got her good side.
Yes, you told us but I am skeptical. And oui, merci beaucoup, vous paysan provinciale, I’ve been working on my metropolitan sound:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfjoZ09ABFg
BTW: That’s not my mother-in-law’s picture; she’s of slighter build and my wife inherited only the best features. 🙂
On the subject of wine and good neighborhoods, one of these days I’d like to know more. Boulder’s been going
postalcoastal on me for a long time and I don’t expect it to reverse.If I had not already settled here, I would be looking at Oklahoma, Wyoming, or Montana.
Yes, those are on my short list.
As a matter of full disclosure, I had dual citizenship until I signed up for Selective Service when I turned 18. Care to guess what the other country was?
Don’t have to guess. You came out of the French closet a while back. 🙂
Is her name Alexis, as in “I’m driving a Lexus?”
Well, I can say started an interesting sub-thread.
Drive on Gator! 🙂
I realize that correlation is not causation, but perhaps leaving them cold (even with plenty of wood)has something to do with the “ex” part? *grin*
Na! She keeps hanging around for some reason. She’s just not my fiance anymore. In fact come Sept. 3rd she’ll have been with me for 32 years. No matter how hard I try sometimes I just can’t seem to make her leave. I think it’s because she likes my body heat on cold winter nights. I also serve certain other functions for her too. In fact she just found a new one the last couple of days. The dog has a virus and has diarrhea for the last couple of days. She can’t hardly go more than two hours without asking to go out in the most urgent manner. And so for the last two nights I’ve been popping out of bed to get her out before I have a mess to clean up. I have had the training for waking up and moving with alacrity at a moments notice and she hasn’t. So she’s well rested and I’m, well…….. sitting here typing on this computer when I should be working on putting in the piers for my new shed.
Waking up at 3 am to let the dog out is impressive. Doing it with “alacrity” is remarkable. (I hope your pup gets better quickly.)
Thanks! There is no reason to get pissed about it. It has to be done and the consequences of not doing it are far worse. So though I would say I’m not really cheerful about it, I certainly don’t resent having to do it.
After two days having her on a bland diet of boiled hamburger and white rice she wasn’t showing improvement. Also a little blood was showing up in her stool. So I called the vet this morning and took her in. She is up to date on her shots and shows no lethargy and in fact is still playful. And she isn’t vomiting so I figured it wasn’t Parvo. But if you can’t get that kind of thing under control by the third day it’s time to get with a pro.
Doc diagnosed it as a virus and put her on flagl. Also fortiflora to try and get the normal bacteria of the gut back up and prednisone for her bowel and rectal inflammation. We continue the bland diet of boiled ground beef and rice. Hopefully this will get her fit again.
Oh, BTW the doc told me he has only lost 2 dogs in the last two years to Parvo. Says that if the owner hasn’t given them pedialite or gatoraide or any other of that type of thing that has a sugar substitute in it and they aren’t fatally septic by the time he gets them, he can save them with antibiotics and subcutaneous injections of normal saline. Needless to say I think I have a pretty darn good vet.
I’m with you – I wouldn’t be thrilled about it, but I would gladly get up to avoid messy problems later in the morning. I just got a chuckle with the adjective “alactrity” in your description.
It is good you have a good vet. Garsh, the best are prohibitively expensive these days, although I found shopping around, that prices vary a bunch in my area.
LOL, Okay, alacrity is a noun. Very descriptive, yes. But not an adjective.
I’m known for some English language innovations myself but I’ve only seen rah using ‘alacrity’ as a noun (I’m working off a tiny mobile screen here).
http://wordsinasentence.com/alacrity-in-a-sentence/
Yeah, I only see that one use in your earlier post, as a noun. No adjective use anywhere. This is some kind of mixup.
And there I used the noun “adjective” as an adjective, if I’m not mistaken.
BTW concerning the pup. She’s doing great. Our little Geisha the Cocker had that serious puppy flu going around that killed a quite a few pups. Not in the respiratory system, but in the gut. For two nights I would get up at her prompting to go outside every hour or two to see her produce a little watery diarrhea. We immediately put her on a bland diet of boiled hamburger and white rice. She would eat and still had some play left in her but she was still lethargic compared to her usual self.
On the third day we took her to the vet. He put her on flagyl, prednizone, and FortiFlora and told us to keep her on the bland diet.
That night the diarrhea was gone but she didn’t poop for almost two days and we started worrying again. Finally she had a more or less regular bowel movement and she is obviously better now. She is being wheened off the Predinzone but will stay on the Flagyl for another week. She LOVES the FortiFlora.
The virus is not what kills them. The virus throws off the growth of normal bacteria and allows damaging bacteria to proliferate. The damaging bacteria attack the walls of the intestines and stomach. Eventually it transmits into the blood stream and and they die of septicemia.
The bland diet denies the bad bacteria the sugars they need to proliferate. The fat is boiled out of the meat so it’s more or less pure protein which is not much use for the bacteria. The rice, though a carbohydrate, digests very slowly in the small intestine so the sugars the body converts it to only show up in the lower portion of the small intestines.
Flagyl goes after the bacteria. The FortiFlora enhances the growth of normal bacteria. The FortiFlora comes in a powder that you just sprinkle on their food. It can be used all the time to promote a healthy digestive tract. Geisha is now back on her regular dog food but once my ex-fiance forgot to put the FortiFlora on it and the pup just looked at her food and then looked back up at her. She got the message. That dog loves the flavor of that stuff.
The US is the “Saudia Arabia” of coal. We will not be running out soon. And when the recovery cost for deeper coal starts to get too expensive, we will turn to nuclear.
Where we are as a civilization is a result of the energy we use. The more energy we use (efficiently), the better our lives. If we want the lives of those living in third world countries to be better, we need to find ways for them to have greater access to energy.
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1IDN6GC5umKRIYBkHazM5yOxP15iC2w8FhS9we7zD-j0/embed?hl=en&size=m#slide=id.p4
Those who think our lives would be better by living in caves and trees will be responsible for the greatest human mass murder committed since Mao Tse Tung and Stalin were forcing their misguided beliefs on a compliant population. The radical environmentalists are no better than Mao Tse Tung and Stalin and if given more control, will be responsible for mass murder.
Yes. As the professor says:
He commented on this article in The American Prospect:
The day will come sometime in the future, far future most likely, when men and women will look back at this James Hansen inspired fear of CO2 and shake their heads in wonder that anyone could believe that more CO2 would lead to the earth getting too warm. It is lunacy. Much like the Tulip Bubble it will be taught in schools and sage teachers will observe that humans periodically go f’ing nuts.
Woke up this morning
couldn’t catch my breath
black lung and silicosis
next up, the coalminer’s death.
I got the blacks……the bituminous coal industry workers blacks…….with at least a 5 times higher death rate by accident at work than the rest of the population, remember me when you look at those stacks
John Le Mucker
You know that when an industry has a disease named for it that it’s not a great occupation if you, if you fancy living a long time
Coalminer’s pneumoconiosis http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/surveillance/ords/CoalMiningRelatedRespiratoryDiseases.html
Right here, today, in 21st century Britain, many thousands of people die prematurely each year simply because they can’t afford to keep their homes warm.
According to recent data, over 5 million British households currently suffer ‘fuel poverty’ – and with steeply rising energy prices, this number is likely to increase.
https://www.ebico.org.uk/fuel-poverty
How many black lung deaths in the UK last year VI?
The social cost of fuel poverty is massive, and growing. In the winter of 2012/13, there were 31,000 extra winter deaths in England and Wales, a rise of 29% on the previous year. Around 30-50% of these deaths can be linked to being cold indoors. And not being able to heat your home also takes a huge toll on health in general: those in fuel poverty have higher incidences of asthma, bronchitis, heart and lung disease, kidney disease and mental health problems.
http://www.theguardian.com/big-energy-debate/2014/sep/11/fuel-poverty-scandal-winter-deaths
Between 1968 and 2007, 75,000 miners nationwide died of black lung, a preventable disease resulting from exposure to coal dust.
It’s irreversible, debilitating and very often fatal.
This must be the new ‘clean coal’
26,632 Americans died of black lung in the period 2000 to 2010
What is the cost of compensation to the victim’s families ? Is it a tax break or a real subsidy ?
East Kentucky black lung incidences are appalling http://archive.courier-journal.com/cjextra/blacklung/index.html
Pay attention Dumb Dumb!
Read again, and answer the question…
Right here, today, in 21st century Britain, many thousands of people die prematurely each year simply because they can’t afford to keep their homes warm.
According to recent data, over 5 million British households currently suffer ‘fuel poverty’ – and with steeply rising energy prices, this number is likely to increase.
https://www.ebico.org.uk/fuel-poverty
How many black lung deaths in the UK last year VI?
The social cost of fuel poverty is massive, and growing. In the winter of 2012/13, there were 31,000 extra winter deaths in England and Wales, a rise of 29% on the previous year. Around 30-50% of these deaths can be linked to being cold indoors. And not being able to heat your home also takes a huge toll on health in general: those in fuel poverty have higher incidences of asthma, bronchitis, heart and lung disease, kidney disease and mental health problems.
http://www.theguardian.com/big-energy-debate/2014/sep/11/fuel-poverty-scandal-winter-deaths
Gator, you quote EBICO.ORG
They just happen to be award winning renewable energy project providers.
Did you check that out first ? They are caring about fuel poverty and they totally support renewable energy…but why shouldn’t they…they aren’t extremists or alarmists who are not hooked on poorly researched newspaper headlines
Gators, preferred source of information is an award winning renewable project supporter and for that I salute Gator !
https://www.ebico.org.uk/blog/?s=renewable
Dismissed.
Gator’s source of data , EBICO.ORG, can help you get your wind turbine or solar project off the ground by offering professional advice
https://www.ebico.org.uk/blog/2012/03/08/community-renewable-energy/
Dismissed.
I missed your reply before Chris..
If you have a 100MW wind farm, what amount of power can you guarantee to provide 95% of the time ?
Chris pleads the fifth! 😆
UK wind currently installed approx. 12GW..
currently supplying about 1.2GW. 10%
Come on Cwuss.. what percentage can you absolutely guarantee to supply 95% of the time.?
1%, 2% capacity factor ? Or am I being too generous.?
The Village Idiot pleads the fifith. Again, and again, and again…
Or maybe his toes cramped up from all the earlier typing.
http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/63151000/jpg/_63151001_rexfeatures_390890mb.jpg
I think what we will see when the subsidies run out and when the stupidity of CO2 demonisation abates, is that electricity will go to a contract situation, whereby the wholesalers pay for tender of ASSURED delivery to meet base load requirements, anything above the normal base-load pay on an “as-required” basis.
That will be the demise of wind energy. It cannot ever guarantee to meet basic supply contracts, no matter how low that contract is set.
Fuel Poverty
Clear skies wake us
the boldness of night
probing for weakness
as frost scuttles south
claiming empires
of fingers and toes
We drink tea
Luke warmed
over a candle
How many in the box?
And wonder if wind barrons
will someday
sleep in their clothes.
http://deepundergroundpoetry.com/poems/31170-fuel-poverty/
Right here, today, in 21st century Britain, many thousands of people die prematurely each year simply because they can’t afford to keep their homes warm.
According to recent data, over 5 million British households currently suffer ‘fuel poverty’ – and with steeply rising energy prices, this number is likely to increase.
https://www.ebico.org.uk/fuel-poverty
How many black lung deaths in the UK last year VI?
The social cost of fuel poverty is massive, and growing. In the winter of 2012/13, there were 31,000 extra winter deaths in England and Wales, a rise of 29% on the previous year. Around 30-50% of these deaths can be linked to being cold indoors. And not being able to heat your home also takes a huge toll on health in general: those in fuel poverty have higher incidences of asthma, bronchitis, heart and lung disease, kidney disease and mental health problems.
http://www.theguardian.com/big-energy-debate/2014/sep/11/fuel-poverty-scandal-winter-deaths
Are black lung deaths any where near this? Are they rising @ 30% per year?
I know math is hard for you, so ask Andy for help. 😆
As I’ve already shown, fuel poverty is term used to described households who have to spend more than 10% of their income keeping warm.
As I have also shown too, the largest cause of inadequate constant temperatures is heat loss through poor insulation and low quality building methods….broken windows and so on.
There is no point people being able to pay to heat their homes when they lose 60% of their heat to the outside….they will just end up further in financial poverty. The solution being employed is free insulation to all households claiming welfare and for the elderly and the most vulnerable there are substantial winter fuel bonus payments ….all at the taxpayers expense.
The key drivers behind fuel poverty are:
The energy efficiency of the property (and therefore, the energy required to heat and power the home)
The cost of energy
Household income
The largest reason for fuel poverty is low efficiency. By tackling efficiency and increasing income the impacts of the increased cost of fuel are reduced.
So once again, you evade the question, because you know I am right.
You can type with your toes! Amazing! 😆
http://cdn2-www.craveonline.com/assets/uploads/2013/02/file_205555_17_The_Return_of_the_Pink_Panther_final_scene.jpg
In 2012, the number of households in fuel poverty in England was estimated at
around 2.28 million, representing approximately 10.4 per cent of all English
households. This is a fall from 2.39 million households in 2011 (a reduction of
almost 5%). In line with this, the aggregate fuel poverty gap (in real terms) also
dropped by around five per cent, from £1.06 billion in 2011 to £1.01 billion in 2012,
as did the average fuel poverty gap over this period, from £445 to £443.
• Due to the relative nature of the LIHC measure, it is difficult to accurately isolate
absolute reasons for changes. However, in summary, changes in income, fuel
costs and energy efficiency levels amongst fuel poor households are broadly
consistent with the changes seen for the population as a whole. Hence the overall
change in the number of households in fuel poverty was relatively small – with the
reduction happening mainly due to income increases for higher income fuel poor
households.
• The reduction in the number of fuel poor households, coupled with the
improvements to incomes and energy efficiency levels for households have
reduced the aggregate and average fuel poverty gap.
• All fuel poor households came from the bottom four income decile groups. In
2012, 41 per cent of all households in the lowest income decile group were fuel
poor, as were 36 per cent of all households in the second income decile group
and 13 per cent of all households in the third and fourth combined income decile
groups.
• The depth and likelihood of being fuel poor increases markedly with lower SAP
scores. In 2012, 35 per cent of households living in G rated properties were fuel
poor compared to only two and seven per cent living in A/B/C and D rated
properties respectively.
• The West Midlands followed by the East Midlands had the highest rate of fuel
poverty (with fuel poverty rates of 15% and 13% respectively). Households living
in the South East and East have the lowest levels of fuel poverty (at 8% and 9%
respectively).
Get back to me when you can answer the question. Otherwise, you are dismissed Dumb Dumb. 😆
How many black lung deaths in the UK last year VI?
Use Google for that info
If you want to know about renewables use the source of your own information…they fully support renewable projects
https://www.ebico.org.uk/blog/2012/03/08/community-renewable-energy/
Gator is doing whatever they can to get more renewables installed….good fella 😉
Dismissed.
From Gators preferred site EBICO.ORG, their guest author demonstrates the positive effects wind power has on the retail price of electricity
http://static1.squarespace.com/static/545e40d0e4b054a6f8622bc9/t/54cb6175e4b0ff3172d9e672/1422614904678/?format=750w
Dismissed.
I missed your reply before Chris..
If you have a 100MW wind farm, what amount of power can you guarantee to provide 95% of the time ?
Chris has once again demonstrated he cannot answer my simple question, just as he did yesterday, because he is dishonest.
Big surprise! 😆
Not answering a stupid question is not dishonest….it’s just not a waste of time but, if you insist.
You asked me how many black lung deaths there were in a year in the UK. You asked me this question in an attempt to play off the number of deaths estimated to take place as a result of fuel poverty, of which only one of the causes is the cost of electricity….as a way to attempt to create an argument which says subsidies paid to renewable projects have increased the price of electricity so much that all the people who died have done so as a result of those price rises. And then we need to look at the number of deaths from black lung of all the miners who dug coal for us to use in the UK
[Have you seen any dishonesty yet ?]
In order to make this an honest comparison Gator, if honesty is your only concern, we need to establish if all of the deaths due to fuel poverty are as a result of high gas, electricity and solid fuel prices.
[not dishonest]
Fuel poverty is a term which is applied when a household has to spend more then 10% of it’s income on heating. The main source of heating in most houses comes from gas and gas prices are consistently volatile over years. This makes it difficult to say if the fuel poverty came as a direct result of the subsidy or as a result of the raw fuel cost increase
[completely true]
How many people die as a result of fuel subsidies ? Is it all of the figure quoted by you Gator relating to all fuel poverty deaths ? if so then that would imply that if there were no subsidies paid to wind then there would be no fuel poverty deaths. To assert your point in such a way is in itself dishonest. The reason it is dishonest is because you did not establish how many deaths occurred due to fuel poverty before wind subsidies were established. The reality is that if there were no subsidies there would continue to be many deaths
[Absolutely true]
The three main causes of fuel poverty are low efficiency buildings, energy cost, and income. Wind subsidies can only affect one of these three causes.
[True]
This proves that to maintain that all of the deaths caused by fuel poverty are caused by wind subsidies, is dishonest.
[Still no dishonesty]
Turning to black lung deaths and how many occur as a result of coal consumption in the UK. The 300 or so deaths by black lung last year in the UK represents merely 15% of the coal consumed . Of the 60 million tonnes consumed, 50 million were imported.
[Still no dishonesty]
Half of all of the coal consumed,, 30 million tonnes. came from Russia. Official figures for the number of black lung deaths in Russia are difficult to find, but due to the established knowledge that health and safety standards and working practices are generally lower in Russia than in the USA for example, it is fair to assume that death rates from black lung in Russia , per worker, exceed that of the USA and most other countries
[nothing dishonest]
Finally, to draw comparisons in order to satisfy Gator’s argument….we need to know how many British and foreign coal miners died producing the 15% and 85% of coal consumed (respectively)….and then consider the number of fuel poverty deaths which might have happened as a result of the small addition of wind subsidies to the cost of electricity, when electricity is used for heating in fewer than 8% of British households, while at the same time eliminating all of the inefficient buildings and low income families from the equation, because Gator’s argument is aimed at wind subsidy application.
[True]
So Gator, do you now still have confidence that wind subsidies kill more people in the UK than black lung kills the miners of our coal ? Be honest.
Finally!
300 vs 31,0000
Less than one percent of fuel poverty deaths, and black lung deaths are decreasing while fuel poverty deaths are increasing due to renewable fascists like the Village idiot.
So that is why you didn’t want to answer! 😆
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycwVQhsRXQc
Back to the subject of the picture at the top: Here’s another nightmare for the carbon-phobes:
http://321energy.com/editorials/mckenziebrown/mckenziebrown102808.html
An estimated 450 billion barrels of oil equivalent in bitumen carbonate deposits in Alberta. This stuff is basically sedimentary rocks saturated with very heavy oil. It’s not economically viable now but after some technology development and increased prices it could well be.
Obama keeping the cost of coal down by keeping the death rate up
US stalls on new coal dust rules as black lung disease spreads
By Clement Daly
9 January 2014
As new coal dust regulations drafted by the Mine Health and Safety Administration (MSHA) await final approval by the Obama administration, black lung disease continues to take its toll on the nation’s miners. The Obama administration was supposed to sign the new standards last year, but has not done so and no explanation has been given. While official numbers are not yet available, hundreds of miners will have died from black lung over the past year alone.
The new rules will cut the legal limit of coal dust exposure in half to 1 milligram per cubic meter, standards which were first advocated by the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health (NIOSH) back in 1995 after health officials noticed a resurgence of black lung after decades of decline.
Gator quoted
“The social cost of fuel poverty is massive, and growing. In the winter of 2012/13, there were 31,000 extra winter deaths in England and Wales, a rise of 29% on the previous year. Around 30-50% of these deaths can be linked to being cold indoors.”
30 -50% of 31,000 equates to roughly 10000 to 15000 [true]
8% of homes use electricity for heating. [True]
8% 0f the above deaths equates to 800 to 1200 deaths (households heated by electricity) [True]
The three causes of fuel poverty are low efficiency buildings, energy cost and low income [True]
Of the 800 to 1200 deaths from fuel poverty in houses heated by electricity, many were as a result of low efficiency of insulation, and many were as a result of low income. [True}
Being mightily generous, if 50% of deaths were as a result of energy price, the number is cut to 400-600 [True]
Remove from this category the number of deaths which would have happened naturally anyway.
Remove from this category the number deaths which occured as a result of the non-subsidy cost rise of electricity.
Remove from this category the number who would still be a victim of electricity prices even if there were no small wind subsidy.
The number you will be left with is less than the number of deaths by black lung in the UK alone, which, when you consider is a reflection of just 15% of all coal consumed,….coal is killing more people than wind subsidies.
We have the answer now Gator….in pure terms of lives lost, coal kills more poeple than wind subsidies (using figures provided by Gator)
Very obviously the UK should be installing insulation at zero cost, rather than wasting the money on useless wind farms.
Oh and still waiting for an answer…..
If you have a 100MW wind farm, what amount of power can you GUARANTEE to provide 95% of the time ?
“Very obviously the UK should be installing insulation at zero cost, rather than wasting the money on useless wind farms.”
Very obviously ?
Check your facts, we already do.
Familles on welfare/child benefit/income support or working families tax credit qualify for free wall insulation, loft insulation and contributions towards replacement double glazing of any single glazed property.
“If you have a 100MW wind farm, what amount of power can you GUARANTEE to provide 95% of the time ?”
Obviously nothing like a coal fired station. I had already answered that many times. The point you don’t want to accept is that as wind installations increase in number then the combined guaranteed dispatchable amount increases proportionally too, based on the distribution of variable wind.presence.
Gator has already provided links to a not for profit energy company’s website which promotes the use of wind as a non-cost solution…it might be worth your while reading that which Gator promotes
I keep telling people that more of them have to be built to make work.
http://www.svz.de/img/mv-uebersicht/crop5632281/9766395786-cv16_9-w596/23-58220868-23-58220869-1391618860.jpg
http://northeastwindmills.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/wv-randolph-barbour.jpg
http://photos.wikimapia.org/p/00/04/09/01/41_big.jpg
“If you have a 100MW wind farm, what amount of power can you GUARANTEE to provide 95% of the time ?”
1 % of nameplate capacity, 2% ????
Be brave, Give me a number, and stop running around like the headless chicken you seem to be.
Wind cannot guarantee supply.. you know that.
#5,, keep digging, little boy !!
““If you have a 100MW wind farm, what amount of power can you GUARANTEE to provide 95% of the time ?”
1 % of nameplate capacity, 2% ????
Be brave, Give me a number, and stop running around like the headless chicken you seem to be.
Wind cannot guarantee supply.. you know that.”
I don’t recall denying it…that part is all in your head
You need not continue waving your feet, we know you are dishonest already. 😆
300 vs 31,0000
Less than one percent of fuel poverty deaths, and black lung deaths are decreasing while fuel poverty deaths are increasing due to renewable fascists like the Village idiot.
And we can assume an aditional 6000+ for the next year, putting us close to 40,000 deaths per year soon, whereas black lung deaths are on the decrease and will be history.
Are black lung disease claims limited to coal miners?
Black lung disease claims are not limited to coal miners. If your occupation involves: grinding of mineral carbon or graphite; even working with carbon electrodes – you might also suffer a similar carbon based anthracosis lung disease.
So that is why you didn’t want to answer! 😆
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycwVQhsRXQc
Don’t yoiu read your own quotes Gator ?
“In the winter of 2012/13, there were 31,000 extra winter deaths in England and Wales, a rise of 29% on the previous year. Around 30-50% of these deaths can be linked to being cold indoors.””
there were 31000 extra winter deaths
Around 30-50% of these can be linked to cold indoors
What is 30-50% of 31000 ?
Still more than 300, and you are counting deaths that did not come from coal production. Black lung deaths are declining, as fuel poverty deaths increase.
And even with all the facts, you still advocate more deaths via your precious windmills.
Still picking pockets and leaving youir neighbors to freeze.
Dismissed!
“300 vs 31,0000”
You don’t include the deaths of Russian miners at all…..I guess because you are a cold war remnant and consider Russian lives to be unworthy of consideration.
The discussion was on UK fatalities Dumb Dumb.
Dismissed!
Not at all…you assumed that it should be that way, you assumed we dig up all our own coal. You were sly, you know it and I know it
Nobody forces men to dig coal. Fuel poverty deaths are people who are executed, and do not volunteer.
How many is acceptable for you Chris? Would you like to choose the sacrificial lambs for your agenda?
Dismissed!
What is 30-50% of 31000 ?
Still cannot do math? 😆
How many is acceptable for you Chris? Would you like to choose the sacrificial lambs for your agenda?
Dismissed!
Fuel poverty deaths are execution ?
Nobody forces people to dig coal ?
If a miner doesn’t work he might end up in fuel poverty or do you have a plan to stop non working miners from becoming poor ?
[Quote[
The bulk of all deaths from CWP are in Pennsylvania, Kentucky, Virginia and West Virginia, with Pennsylvania accounting for most of them. Of the men in the Big Branch disaster, 17 of 24 had some form of the disease, including men as young as 25. Five of the men found to have CWP in those autopsies had been involved in mining for less than 10 years
[Unquote]
Through the necessity of having to earn a living to support their families miners are executed slowly.
But Gator thinks that there is a job for everyone who does not want to go down a mine…..well , where are all those jobs ? Without miners there is no coal
So your country can afford to build windmils, but not take care of the poor?
Some people decide to be firemen to feed their families. Should we stop them?
And again, we are discussing the UK, focus Dumb Dumb. 😆
Like I say, if you can guarantee that nobody will die of fuel poverty if wind subsidies are ended I will be for the removal of wind subsidies.
By the same token, will you demand we no longer use coal due to the horrendous deaths miners have to suffer…..or maybe you would like to say how many sacrificial lamb miners is an acceptable number ?
My father died from lung cancer caused by agent orange exposure in Viet Nam. He had no regrets. He knew, just like every other member of my family who has volunteered for service, that there is a risk of death. Coal miners are not as a rule stupid. Neither are fire fighters.
Those that die because people like you demand government mandates, did not volunteer.
Don’t talk to me about suffering. I watched my own father wither away for years, and I was by his side when he died.
Dismissed.
“Those that die because people like you demand government mandates,”
Imaginatives like you only imagine that I demand government mandates in order to satisfy your skewed thoughts
I have never ever demanded a government subsidy for wind…or anything else for that matter
I have also never demanded that miners be sent to dig for coal, but understand that they must do it or they fail to thrive. I used to live in Yorkshire, coal mining country and can talk about many suicides as a result of mine closures by men who lost all hope and could not support their family due to them finding it impossible to find alternative work.
As a result of lost income, some people died of fuel poverty then, in the days before wind subsidies were even thought of.
If you can tell me how many people die of wind subsidies I will ask the government to stop giving them out. I doubt you would do the same for coal miners but this isn’t a game, I’m being real.
Give me the number of deaths caused by wind subsidies for inclusion into my letter to government
Once again, Dumb Dumb does not know the difference between voluntary sacrifice and involuntary sacrifice.
My father died from lung cancer caused by agent orange exposure in Viet Nam. He had no regrets. He knew, just like every other member of my family who has volunteered for service, that there is a risk of death. Coal miners are not as a rule stupid. Neither are fire fighters.
Those that die because of people like you, who advocate government mandates, did not volunteer.
Dismissed.
“And we can assume an additional 6000+ for the next year, putting us close to 40,000 deaths per year soon, ”
How many of those have you attributed to a small increase in the retail price of electricity ?
How many are as a result of a drop in income ?
How many are as a result of a low efficiency buildings ?
How does this figure compare to the number fuel poverty deaths on other countries ? – have you noticed that fuel poverty does not officially exist in the USA, because the government are scared to measure this metric ?
If there is no wind subsidy are there no fuel poverty deaths ?
How many is acceptable for you Chris? Would you like to choose the sacrificial lambs for your agenda?
Dismissed!
If you can guarantee that if wind subsidies came to an end then nobody will die of fuel poverty I will support full removal of wind subsidies. I can’t say any fairer than that
False logic.
What we do know, is that government mandates for windmills causes more deaths, and they are not volunteers, but innocent victims. Of you.
“What we do know, is that government mandates for windmills causes more deaths, and they are not volunteers, but innocent victims. Of you.”
You have yet to produce a number representative of the number of deaths as a result of wind subsidies.
In your own time
You give me a number you can live with killer. What is it? How many?
My father died from lung cancer caused by agent orange exposure in Viet Nam. He had no regrets. He knew, just like every other member of my family who has volunteered for service, that there is a risk of death. Coal miners are not as a rule stupid. Neither are fire fighters.
Those that die because people like you demand government mandates, did not volunteer.
Don’t talk to me about suffering. I watched my own father wither away for years, and I was by his side when he died.
Dismissed.
“You give me a number you can live with killer. What is it? How many?”
As soon as you give me the actual number I won’t need to guess.
You say you know the number of people being killed by wind subsidies, how many is it ?
I have never supported subsidies but I have never be active to get them stopped. Once you tell me how many died i will be active about getting them stopped.
you understand why i need a number don’t you, there needs to be proof
Chris is avoiding the fact that his advocacy is leading to additional deaths, from people who do not volunteer to make a sacrifice.
Let’s say it is one Chris.
Would you still advocate an unreliable and costly energy source for one murder?
Whether you kill one innocent, or one million, you are still a killer.
Quote from a money saving expert site in the UK copied in below.
“Free stuff – we’re talking £1,000s’ worth – is a sexier phrase than “Energy Company Obligations (ECO) scheme” but they’re the same thing. Many big energy providers are giving away boilers, plus loft and cavity wall insulation, to people who get tax credits and have an income of £16,010 or less, or are receiving certain benefits such as pension credit.
But British Gas is giving away free loft and cavity wall insulation to anyone with a suitable home – you don’t need to meet the benefit criteria. In addition, there’s the Green Deal Home Improvement Fund.
It offers up to £1,850 cashback towards energy saving measures such as floor insulation, double or secondary glazing, fan-assisted storage heaters and more. “
Good to see they are doing something sensible.
Wasting more on useless wind turdines that can’t be guaranteed to supply more than a tiny fraction of their nameplate, maybe, if they are lucky , now that sure is pretty darn stupid.
What was that guaranteed percentage again…… you mentioned you had told us.
I can’t seem to find it anywhere. 😉
And just in case you have forgotten the question..
“If you have a 100MW wind farm, what amount of power can you GUARANTEE to provide 95% of the time ?”
Days like 8/4 2015 are NOT a good advertisement for wind power..
at 2:05 ZERO out of a total nameplate of around 12GW… that’s , let me see.. oh.. ZERO % !!!
Wonderful reliability!.
Although I doubt too many birds or bats died from chopping an exploding that day. !
https://twitter.com/clivehbest/status/585903703355482112/photo/1
Tell you what Cwuss, seeing you think more wind is better…
What percentage can you absolutely GUARANTEE for 95% of the time from the whole UK wind network ???
Give me a simple basic number. Can you guarantee 1%?, 2%?
meant to type..
What percentage “of nameplate” can you absolutely GUARANTEE for 95% of the time from the whole UK wind network ???
I guarantee much more than thorium…cheaper than nuclear…causing fewer deaths than coal
You can’t guarantee any of those, because you can’t or won’t say how much you can guarantee to deliver.
Wind energy CANNOT DELIVER.. you know that, but you still squirm like the little worm that you are.
For the tiny , tiny amount that you might be able to guarantee, wind will be massively more polluting, costly and deadly to all forms of life, per MW of guaranteed electricity production.
Answer the question…. you gutless wonder.
We might just hear you from the bottom of that hole you are in.
I CAN guarantee it
I CAN guarantee that wind, installed at it’s current capacity, can always produce more than the installed thorium generation….because it already does
I CAN guarantee that wind is cheaper than nuclear, once you add in the decommissioning cost of at least £50 per MWh of electricity produced, to the total cost of nuclear
I CAN guarantee that the number of deaths in the wind industry is less than the number of coal mining related deaths….at current death rates I actually doubt that we can install enough wind to compete with coal in fact….when compared per unit of electricity.
First Andy says a figure cannot be guaranteed….then says “For the tiny , tiny amount that you might be able to guarantee,”
You see Andy…it can be guaranteed and you know it
And of course you convenient forget/ignore the copious amounts of coal and other fossil fuels that go into making those useless, destructive, highly unreliable wind turbines.
No you CANNOT guarantee anything, except your empty cowardly rhetoric.
Stop sliming around in the ooze at the bottom of your pit. and answer the question.. !!
Put a number to the UNRELIABILITY of wind turbines.
What percentage of nameplate capacity can you guarantee to deliver 95% of the time.
Odumbo is shutting down coal which means the NatGas bonanza is going to be squandered on electricity. That’s if and when the EPA allows new plants to be built.
No Natural Gas also emits CO2. Obama has point blank stated his goals:
Chris The Wind Barron and the Black Lung Disease Red Herring
Black Lung | United Mine Workers of America
Can black lung disease be prevented?
Discover Zinkan’s line of DCG products and how they can help protect you and your crew against black lung disease.
GAME, SET, MATCH….
Technology is taking care of the problem.
Those dying today are the people who were mining BEFORE the new OSHA regs went into effect. Black lung is not curable.
Please note that my father worked for Johns-Manville (asbestosis) and had lung cancer. He also smoked three packs of Camels a day. I chose not to have kids after I discovered the chemicals I was working with as a chemist were mutagens.
No one promised us a completely safe and happy life but what we have had for the past 75 years beats the crap out of the life people in the 1700s had or the life people in third world countries have now.
What the Progressive elite aims to do is condemn our children to serfdom and a life that is nasty brutal and short. After all those over retirement age are useless eaters and as the UK has shown there are various methods, like Fuel Poverty and the Liverpool Care Pathway that can be used to terminate the useless old folks as quickly as possible without raising an out cry from the public.
At Kyoto in 1992 Maurice Strong was very blunt in targeting the middle class for erratication:
“It is clear that current lifestyles and consumption patterns of the affluent middle class, involving high meat intake, consumption of large amounts of frozen and convenience foods, use of fossil fuels, appliances, home and work place air conditioning, and suburban housing are not sustainable.”
As Petr Beckmann pointed out freedom and progress is based on ‘Access to Energy’ The elite are going to cut off the middle classes access and shove us back into third world conditions.
Hey Gail! We are dealing with a zealot here, so there is no cure for his ignorance. I pointed out yesterday that Black Lung Disease has several causes. He knows he is FOS, but he is a religious zealot.
What causes coal workers’ pneumoconiosis (CWP)?
The inhalation and accumulation of coal dust causes coal workers’ pneumoconiosis (CWP). This stems from working in a coal mine, coal trimming (loading and stowing coal for storage), mining or milling graphite, and manufacturing carbon electrodes (used in certain types of large furnaces) and carbon black (a compound used in many items, such as tires and other rubber goods). Because CWP is a reaction to accumulated dust in the lungs, it may appear and get worse during your exposure to the dust or after your exposure has ceased.
http://www.webmd.com/lung/tc/black-lung-disease-topic-overview
He is worse than Hope Forpeace. 😆
Chris the Wind Barron has a vested interest in repairing the bat-chomping bird-slicing eco-crucifixes. He is willing to see people die as a result and sooth his conscience with blather about black lung and unprofitable nuclear.
http://world-nuclear.org/uploadedImages/OrgFurniture/Homepage/Header/WNAlogo.png
Actually Gail, Chris is simply ignorant, and I have a file of his uneducated spewings to prove it! 😆
Thanks VI!
It would be interesting to do a study of the diseases that occur due to mining and processing the enormous rare earth magnets and all the petroleum based composites that go into making wind turdines.
Wind turdines cannot be made without copious input of fossil fuels.
We already know the massive environmental damage done to get the huge amounts of neodymium required. Production of rare earths was well controlled until wind turdines came on the scene. The huge surge in production due to their necessity in wind turdine rotors has poisoned large tracts of land in China forcing farming communities off their once useful land. This will never be able to be remediated.
How many deaths have occurred because of it, we will probably never know.
This is acceptable in the name of wind turdines.
They are the filthiest, most destructive and polluting useless devices in the world.
https://www.google.com.au/search?q=baotou+pollution&rls=com.microsoft:en-AU:IE-SearchBox&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=MkM0VcnKO6LbmAXPr4HQDA&ved=0CB0QsAQ&biw=1324&bih=746
Gosh, if only there were a photo of the devastation…
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/01/28/article-1350811-0CF36063000005DC-625_634x286.jpg
This toxic lake poisons Chinese farmers, their children and their land. It is what’s left behind after making the magnets for Britain’s latest wind turbines… and, as a special Live investigation reveals, is merely one of a multitude of environmental sins committed in the name of our new green Jerusalem
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-1350811/In-China-true-cost-Britains-clean-green-wind-power-experiment-Pollution-disastrous-scale.html#ixzz3Xnu93Gg1
WOW.. did you know that the mining of rare earths for wind turbines produces MORE radioactive waste than the spent fuel from nuclear reactors ?
quote ”
To quantify this in terms of environmental damages, consider that mining one ton of rare earth minerals produces about one ton of radioactive waste, according to the Institute for the Analysis of Global Security. In 2012, the U.S. added a record 13,131 MW of wind generating capacity. That means that between 4.9 million pounds (using MIT’s estimate) and 6.1 million pounds (using the Bulletin of Atomic Science’s estimate) of rare earths were used in wind turbines installed in 2012. It also means that between 4.9 million and 6.1 million pounds of radioactive waste were created to make these wind turbines.
For perspective, America’s nuclear industry produces between 4.4 million and 5 million pounds of spent nuclear fuel each year. That means the U.S. wind industry may well have created more radioactive waste last year than our entire nuclear industry produced in spent fuel.”
forgot the link
http://instituteforenergyresearch.org/analysis/big-winds-dirty-little-secret-rare-earth-minerals/
Chris? Care to comment? Of course you will! 😆
Chris is a more interesting phenomenon to me.
At least Hope knew when to stop digging.
She hit the bedrock.
And Chris?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WF8Bf1d_crk
Hope hit rock bottom and kept flopping in the same spot like a dying mackerel. In fact, she was brain dead before she got there.
Chris hit rock bottom on certain subjects and he avoids them now.
If imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, then maybe avoidance is the yellow-bellied cousin of integrity.
He knows.
He knows.
He knows nothing, he was not even aware that he is part of a religion…
“Atheism is religion… even though it expressly rejects a belief in a supreme being,”
https://cases.justia.com/federal/appellate-courts/ca7/13-1009/13-1009-2013-08-16.pdf
We both called him out on it and he studiously avoided it, just like several other things. That’s what I mean. He can recognize thin ice.
He doesn’t know where he is and why he’s there but he’s here for different reasons than Hope.