That happened 130 years ago. It was the hottest temperature ever recorded in Europe. CO2 was 280 ppm at the time.
Disrupting the Borg is expensive and time consuming!
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As we all know, weather before 1950 never happened and until 1979, there was no way to accurately measure the temperature.
What a beautiful building!
I think we found the culprit…
Thomas Alva Edison:
1880 – Invented further improvements in systems and details for electric lighting and laid the first groundwork for introducing them on a commercial basis. Established the first incandescent lamp factory at Menlo Park, N. J.
I wonder if 40,000 Spaniards died back then as compared to the European heat wave of 2003.
Of course, we can’t engage in simple minded comparisons. For example, in 2003 the temperatures over France reached a 104 degrees Fahrenheit in the daytime for over a week. What was deadly about it was that it did not go below the 90s That is why many elderly people died.
Another concept that non quantifying, anecdotal information fails to take into account is the meaning of averages as well as frequency.
Simple example:
Let’s say that, a hundred years ago, in a place called Pleasant Land, the highest temperature reached in the summer was 101 degrees but the average was 85F.
A hundred years later, in Pleasant Land, the highest summer temperature has only reached 98 degrees; no record broken for a hundred years. However, the average has consistently been 90 degrees, 5 degrees warmer.
Guess which is more important? The average or a temporary peak?
What is more important – an actual temperature record or your baseless ramblings?
http://www.spiked-online.com/articles/00000006DEC3.htm
I was at the beach in Christchurch the week before the heatwave hit in 2003. It was miserably cold. I wish I had waited a week and had the opportunity to enjoy the warm weather.
Speaking of heat … I have an above-ground pool with no heater. Last year with the strong El Nino, we were swimming in the pool the entire last week of May, and the water temp was in the mid to high 80’s. This spring (in southern Ontario) has been quite cool. April and May were cold and rainy. June has had a few hot days, but nothing like it usually is. I just opened the pool yesterday … the water temp is in the 70’s. The kids are in it for 5 to 10 minutes and get out with their teeth chattering :(.
if only the average went up….it’s UHI
Come on Ill, you’re not even trying!!!
He’s off having a conversation with himself:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLvIFRNbqOs
If you raise the average temperature you’re going to tend to see the relative maximums and minimum temperatures increase as well as the temps shift upward. You’re unlikely to see the average temperatures increase, but somehow the peak temperatures fall although that would be convenient for the warmist crowd. Now wouldn’t it?
“I wonder if 40,000 Spaniards died back then as compared to the European heat wave of 2003.” – ill
I wonder if they had 40K elderly people warehoused away alone or with inadequate care back then especially seeing as the life expectancy was a tad less back then.
Well, lets suppose for example that there were more 100+ degree days in Cities A, B and C during the summers of 1930, 1934 and 1936 than there have been recorded in said cities during last 20 years and that nearly all the daily, monthly and all time records set in the 1930’s still exist in 2011, that we have indeed had catastrophic warming take place between 1936 and 2011?
So, what do you think is more important? That the daily records still stand? That the monthly records still stand? That the hottest summer records still stand? That the all time high temperature records still stand?
@IWB: “I wonder if 40,000 Spaniards died back then as compared to the European heat wave of 2003.”
How many Spaniards DID die in the European heatwave of 2003? It wasn’t 40,000. If this isn’t what you meant, comparing Spain to all of Europe is apples and oranges … or cherries and oranges if you prefer.
1,000,000 people died in automobile accidents in 2003
1,000,000 people died in automobile accidents in 2003″
So, based on this irrelevant reply, I guess that you won’t pay any attention to a similar situation unless a million and one persons die of heat stroke in one year.
@IWB … so how do you suggest we stop heatwave deaths? How much colder would you like it to be?
@IWB: “That is why many elderly people died.”
That is what happens when you have an aging population like most western European nations have.
Brilliant! So we can expect the same disproportionate number of people dying every single year.
Why do you think that those figures were given in the first place? It certainly wasn’t the normal mortality rate.
Zzzzzzz.
So, heat waves exist because of CO2 emissions? Is that what you’re saying?
Or, could it be that heat waves have occurred since time on earth started and no one but the most fervent true believer considers occasional heat waves as anything other than a natural occurrence.
People die of heat, cold, disease, car accidents, blah, blah, blah. By IWB’s logic, heatwaves are a result of AGW and must be stopped. That is like saying we have to do something about water because of people drowning.
@IWB: http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2011/04/14/june-1934-all-48-states-over-100-degrees/
“There were an average of 11,500 snow-shoveling injuries and related medical emergencies each year from 1990 through 2006, according to a study published in the American Journal of Emergency Medicine.
The toll is even larger when all types of “manual snow and ice removal tools” are lumped together. The most recent estimates from 2009 suggest there were more 26,000 injuries from shovels, ice breakers, scrapers and similar implements.
The Emergency Medicine study found that while heart injuries accounted for only 7 percent of all snow-shovel-related injuries, they were by far the most serious— responsible for half of all hospitalizations and all of 1,647 fatalities associated with shoveling snow.”
http://www.suntimes.com/news/nation/3528619-418/snow-injuries-2009-emergency-ice.html
We’ve got to hault catastophic global cooling, or we will see an extinction of all human life in the midwest if these trends continue.
@IWB: Cold kills more people than heat does …
http://www.statistics.gov.uk/pdfdir/deaths1110.pdf
“Cold kills more people than heat does …”
This is the typical simpleton reply I’ve come to expect. One dimensional thinking at its best.
Pump up the heat and expand deserts while shrinking farming zones. How many people will that not kill? Why don’t you read up on something real like the PETN. If I recall correctly the temperatures went up to 6C.
I also recall a poster here, not too long ago, suggesting that even a 10C rise might be a good thing.
So tell me, is there no limit to how high the temperature can go before climate/weather systems go whacko? At what point do crops get destroyed on a regular basis? Or perhaps you don’t believe, other than making things warmer, that heat effects weather.
“Cold kills more people than heat does …”
Oh, I almost forgot. Your PDF, restricted to England and Wales, isn’t even intended to make a comparison between cold related deaths and heat related deaths. Furthermore England and Wales are not the planet.
Don’t you realize how ridiculous it is for you to make any claims about cold killing more people than heat when you’re not even attempting to take this entire planet into account? Why don’t you start with the several million african farmer who starved to death because of drought?
“I wonder if 40,000 Spaniards died back then as compared to the European heat wave of 2003.”
Europe isn’t the entire planet. Pot-kettle.
“Why don’t you start with the several million african farmer who starved to death because of drought?”
Drought is a precipitation issue … the polar regions are classified as deserts due to lack of precipitation. African farmers starved due to drought because (1) they tend to be in drought-prone areas to begin with and (2) their techniques and equipment are primitive compared to ours. With proper machinery and irrigation, much fewer farmers would have died.
P.S. Africa is not the entire planet either.
lol, now who’s being ridiculous…….. drought = heat?……uhmm, no, not even. And yes, heat, as known within normal limits of earth temps is much more to survive than cold of earth’s normal limits. But, IWB, all you’d have to do is think about is for a second and consider the extreme temp places of the earth. Is there anything that survives in the interior Antarctic? Anything grow there? No? Even in the most extreme deserts, there are life forms living.
“Pump up the heat and expand deserts while shrinking farming zones. How many people will that not kill?”
Warmer means MORE areas to farm, not less. If it warmed several degrees Canada and Russia would gain huge areas newly fit for farming. As another commenter mentioned, the Sahel is greening and the Sahara shrinking. The facts just completely contradict you.
“So tell me, is there no limit to how high the temperature can go before climate/weather systems go whacko?”
Why would a warming climate make the weather go “wacko”? Global warming theory holds that the poles will warm faster than the tropics, therefore lessening temperature differences. Temperature differences are the main cause of “extreme” weather events, such as the tornadoes we’ve had this year in the United States. If anything, the opposite should be true — that we should have fewer instances of “wacko” weather, not more.
“This is the typical simpleton reply I’ve come to expect. One dimensional thinking at its best. ”
Did you even read the link I posted?
“Pump up the heat and expand deserts while shrinking farming zones”
The Sahara desert has shrunk by 300000 square kilometers and is now growing trees. Warming causes farming zones to increae, not decrease (MWP … grapes in England, Vikings farmed Greenland; Holocene Maximum … civilization and agriculture flourish in the Fertile Crescent region). Crop yields keep going up, not down. Do you ever read anything other than your deluded AGW nonsense?
“How many people will that not kill?”
Why would you give a damn? On a recent thread, in response to the issue of Manhattan being swallowed up by the sea and the residents having to leave, you said “not that I care”. I once asked you what you were doing to prevent global warming since it seemed like such an issue for you. No reply.
” Why don’t you read up on something real like the PETN”
That would be the PETM, as in “M” for maximum. That was 55 million years ago … not our fault.
“I also recall a poster here, not too long ago, suggesting that even a 10C rise might be a good thing.”
It wasn’t me, so who cares?
“So tell me, is there no limit to how high the temperature can go before climate/weather systems go whacko? At what point do crops get destroyed on a regular basis? Or perhaps you don’t believe, other than making things warmer, that heat effects weather.”
I asked you (above), “so how do you suggest we stop heatwave deaths? How much colder would you like it to be?” As is your style, you dodge the question and ask a question in return. Until you answer that question, I refuse to answer yours. I have had enough of your contrarian stupidity for one day. TTFN …
The earth is cooling and likely will cool for a couple more decades.
Cold does kill more people than heat. And it’s not just the cold weather that kills them. They start killing each other too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8C1CKKhN7ng
I’m following ill’s “logic”, but I can’t understand how the 1918 Spanish flu pandemic could have occurred in the idyllic low CO2 days of yesteryear. Since we can justifiably blame all deaths that are even remotely connected with the weather on Anthropogenic CO2 hence “climate change” How did this event happen?
Authors of the paper in Nature say 50 million people were killed in the pandemic.