Climate science is complex, and the terminology can be tricky. I created this visual glossary of Greenland Surface Mass Balance to help guide people through it.
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Hey Tony – favor pls. Often – like when NOAA announces that July is the warmest July on record – you put together a gif file – which shows the actual sta coverage. I can never find it on their site (State of the Climate). Would you post the link to it. Thanks
re: https://realclimatescience.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/NOAAFebruary18Land2-1.gif
Yeah!
Could do something similar with Roy Spencer’s temperature chart.
With the “Climate” caption at the El Ninos of 1998 and 2016.
And decline since as “Weather”.
The Left’s fraud is so obvious.
Looking at the graph, the mass loss Greenland’s experienced this is still greater than the average, even taking that one day of extreme loss out of the equation.
No slur, Greenland mass loss is totally insignificant
Here is a graph of the Total Greenland Ice Mass since 1900, what do you notice.
https://i.postimg.cc/vZ83sQdq/Greenland_ice_mass2.png
Also , Greenland has far more ice area than it has had for most of the last 8000+ years.
https://i.postimg.cc/VkYrnZhL/Greenland-Ice-Sheet-Briner.jpg
Time you did some actual learning instead of living with a closed, shrinking mind.
Still far less than the average of the past 9000 years Little Man. In other words, there is no there there.
Why do you natural climate change and science deniers hate poor brown people?
“the mass loss Greenland’s experienced this is still greater than the average”
Assuming a fairly regular distribution, we expect a greater than average loss about 50% of the time.
Jason, please don’t try to point that out to math-challenged people, ok? Especially the Warmites.
Thanks. :)
For the sake of argument, lets say the ice loss at Greenland were to become double your so called ‘average’ and remain that way going forward. How many years would it take until just one half of the ice sheet there were gone?
To put it a different way, how many years until we would get even one foot of SLR?
(Hint, excessive melting at Greenland is not happening fast as it is not happening at all! Long term stable tide gauges show no trend in SLR)
“Looking at the graph, the mass loss Greenland’s experienced this is still greater than the average, even taking that one day of extreme loss out of the equation.”
You’d have to say more accurately summer ice loss and just in comparison to the average over that time span from 1981. Sadly it does not show the trend of ice over the years from 1981 year on year.
Ice melt this summer has been larger than the last 2 years, but what is the general trend over the whole year?
I’m not going to mention the Holocene because it is completely irrelevant as are the other comments on this thread such as the future and “fairly regular distribution” blah blah
Andy
The Holocene is not irrelevant, it is damned inconvenient for you drooling trolls. Why in Gaia’s name should we expect ice not to melt as we continue to exit the coldest period in the last 9000 years. Ice in the Arctic is the exception, and not the rule. Of course Andy Andy wants to dismiss the whole truth, because by telling only half truths he can try and hoodwink other mental midgets into swearing that the sky is falling and it is all our fault.
Lies of omission are still lies Andy Andy.
“The Holocene is not irrelevant, it is damned inconvenient for you drooling trolls. Why in Gaia’s name should we expect ice not to melt as we continue to exit the coldest period in the last 9000 years. Ice in the Arctic is the exception, and not the rule. Of course Andy Andy wants to dismiss the whole truth, because by telling only half truths he can try and hoodwink other mental midgets into swearing that the sky is falling and it is all our fault.
Lies of omission are still lies Andy Andy.”
Show me the Holocene graphs in August for Greenland so we can compare.
??
Good luck
Andy
Of course little Andy Andy thinks he is being cute by asking for monthly values for the entire Holocene, but what little Andy Andy actually did was prove my point.
The drooling trolls are the most dishonest people you will ever meet. Little Andy Andy knows damn well that an ice free Arctic that existed for thousands of years would of course include August as ice free. Little Andy Andy isn’t bright enough to know that his childish postings mean nothing to the adults in the room.
Lies and obfuscations are all little Andy Andy has.
Here is the trend in Greenland Total Ice Mass since 1900, little-andy.
https://i.postimg.cc/vZ83sQdq/Greenland_ice_mass2.png
And here it is for the Holocene, only just a small amount down from the highest area in 8000+ years.
https://i.postimg.cc/VkYrnZhL/Greenland-Ice-Sheet-Briner.jpg
Or are you a climate change DENIER that DENIES basic climate facts?
“I’m not going to mention the Holocene because it is completely irrelevant “
The only thing TOTALLY IRRELEVANT are your mindless climate DENIER comments, little-andy. !
Guess what, ignorant little twerp, the Holocene exists and for nearly all of it, it has been WARMER than it is now.
In summary a graph from this source showing very little detail from past years is not good in 2019 and still has nothing to do with the Holocene.
Little Andy
LOL, little Andy, still a climate change denier, aren’t you petal.
Come on, ADMIT that Greenland Ice levels are in both mass and extent are currently above what they have been for most of the last 10,000 years
You cannot live in climate denial all your little life, little andy.
Taking into account that the mean in the accumulation graph encompasses a mid-negative to mid-positive AMO cycle, then to interpret and quantify any one year, that years position within the AMO cycle needs to be considered. 2011-12 were during a positive cycle thus we should expect less mass and as we move more towards the negative cycle the mass will increase again. Graph source Gan et al. paper here
https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1029/2018EA000443
“Looking at the graph, the mass loss Greenland’s experienced this is still greater than the average”
So what if it did? Why should ANYONE care?
How many people died?
Yes and the mass gains in Nov/Dec were also greater than the average, so what’s your point?
During the cold-war our lives were over-shaddowed constantly by the threat of catastrophic nuclear conflict. Less the present tenable perhaps false sense of security, a new threat is emerging – global geo-tampering by mad scientists. Multitudes of honest Scientists have been entrained into the AGW lie by the crafty machinations and tampering of the data sets they relie upon. These same mislead scientists will uphold these environMENTAL engineering solutions most of which are no more than global experiments in Russian roulette. How do I vote as a free citizen of earth to not do it???
https://patents.google.com/patent/US20110284650
I still don’t like that graph as no year on year graph or the long term trend.
Is there a version similar to this
https://ads.nipr.ac.jp/vishop/#/extent/&time=2019-03-13%2000:00:00
for Greenland?
Thanks
Andy
I do not like these graphs because there is no way they are measuring anything to get those graphs…it is all modeled results.
IMO, the sea level trends shows us clearly that there is no long term overall tendency for the ice sheets to be melting, at least to the extent they can be believed.
Most compelling is the 100% lack of any visual evidence that the ocean is encroaching on the land.
Literally every single old photograph where one can see the level of the ocean in an identifiable geographic location, shows that there is virtually zero change in as much as 100 years or more, when these photos are compared with a picture of that same area now or in the very recent past.
It simply cannot be seen.
Anywhere.
(The only exceptions are the irrelevant examples of places where tectonic forces have changed the level of the land and/or the sea bed.)
Of course the true believers in CAGW will tell you that the reason why you can’t see accelerating sea level rise is that the oceans are getting deeper, the bottom is dropping just enough to hide the additional water.
Ad hoc hypothesis, anyone?
I like that…. so if the ocean bottoms are dropping enough to prevent sea Surface Level rise…
What’s the danger?
Sorry… sounded like a sensible question before I typed it…
And how do they know the ocean floor isn’t rising, thus causing the VERY SLIGHT and constant sea level rise we are currently having. ;-)
“or the long term trend”
Here is the long term trend, little andy.
https://i.postimg.cc/VkYrnZhL/Greenland-Ice-Sheet-Briner.jpg
And here is the long term trend in Ice Mass..
https://i.postimg.cc/vZ83sQdq/Greenland_ice_mass2.png
And the long term trend in temperature.
https://i.postimg.cc/90DDYy9G/greenland_temp.png
And a mid -term trend in temperature
https://i.postimg.cc/xTGGxgBX/greenland1.jpg
And the longer term Arctic sea ice.
https://i.postimg.cc/TYWZMHb1/Arctic-Sea-Ice-Changes-Chukchi-Sea-Yamamoto-2017.jpg
Live in DENIAL, little-andy, denying that current Artcic sea ice is still in the top 50-10% of the last 10,000 years, and that the late 1970’s was a time of anomalously HIGH Arctic sea ice, which the Arctic has thankfully partially recovered from.
WOW, they really are showing that there is ONE HECK OF A LOT of sea ice in the Arctic, and one heck of a lot of ice on Greenland, aren’t they little andy
Wouldn’t you agree that there is far more of both than there has been for most of the current interglacial.
Probably because the planet is only a small bump above the COLDEST period in 10,000 years.
Is that big drop even valid? Seems like it has not changed post acknowledgement that the temp data was faulty and I believe the melt algorithm favors in temp. https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/08/12/greenlands-record-temperature-denied-the-data-was-wrong/
It’s amusing that when you agree with Tony’s post pointing out the Greenland summer season media hyperbole, compared to past 2 years, then you still get two idiots called Spike and Gator still arguing against you and Tony.
Go figure
Andy
Being called an idiot by little Andy Andy is a badge of honor for those of us who can think for themselves.
Little Andy Andy believes he can simply dismiss entire epochs with a waive of his tiny hands, and then lie to us some more.
Go figure, because little Andy Andy cannot.
Blessedly not Andy
Poor little andy, still unable to admit the truth, aren’t you, coward.
I DARE you too ADMIT that current levels of both Arctic and Greenland ice are significantly above what they have been for most of the last 10,000 years.
Run and hide and distract like a headless chook, we will only be laughing at your wilful DENIAL of climate change.
A P-38 that landed on Greenland in 1942 was under 340ft of ice by 2018. An earlier P-38 recovered was at 260ft in 1988 and 268ft by 1992.
That doesn’t suggest massive surface melt does it – they would have been sitting on the surface in a puddle quietly rotting during summer.
It generally melts in the summer and builds up in the winter.
And the depth of the P-38s indicates that one has obviouly greatly exceeded the other. Else they’d be on the surface rotting in a puddle……….
So it melts in the summer,
it snows in the winter (=plane get covered)
melts in summer=plane gets uncovered.
Without drilling or massive ice gain the plane could not get so deep into the ice.
If there had been multiple thaw and refreeze cycles in the snow, then nev/firn, then ice once the P-38 F now named Glacier Girl had been buried the air frame would have probably been dismembered and crushed beyond restoration. Lots of cavities for water to easily get into an immersed aircraft and refreeze. So the very condition of the aircraft as found argues against there being much thaw and refreeze occurring.
The B-17 that landed with them (the first to be exposed) was dismembered and crushed beyond restoration. They figured the more robust P-38 might have survived better and so they recovered one of them. It was less damaged but still required a lot of restoration, I think they used about 80% of the parts recovered.
Here’s a photo during recovery:
https://damn-8791.kxcdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/05/glacier_girl.jpg
Buy Greenland!
Music to my ears! Making Globalists and Tyrants heads explode around the world.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=gWAgIVNzHKs
The charts say “polarportal.org”. Don’t go there. It’s some sort of phishing site that wanted to install a Chrome extension. The correct site is polarportal.dk.
Hi Tony,
don’t you wanna write an epitaph to the loss of a deerly loved glacier, which vanished in Greenland almost without a trace and who has so far triggered so many tears from climatechange hysterics, that, would there be any chill left, he’d frozen over anew.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-climate-change-iceland/iceland-unveils-memorial-plaque-for-lost-glacier-idUSKCN1V80ME
I’m looking forward to a video on your channel!
Drooling moron memorial.
Ok is the first Icelandic glacier to lose its status as a glacier.
Maybe on paper. But certainly this is nothing new, unless you count the moaning and hand wringing of useful idiots.
“Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I’m not sure about the former.”
-Albert Einstein
The volcanic island of Iceland you mean?
No seriously, I’d like to see this nonsense debunked in typical Heller-Style, dry, factual and devastating.
Ice melts Michael. There is really nothing to debunk. A bunch of idiots stood around moaning about a perfectly natural event. If you live in Iceland, and have at least half a brain, melting ice is a good thing.
Not even Tony can fix stupid.