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Democide: DEATH BY GOVERNMENT
Australia has a form of gun control. Perhaps if you post the deaths from “gun control” in Australia, alongside these other countries? Along with the death rate from guns on a per capita basis?
What is your point? Are you trying to point out that the Australian government is not killing the citizens despite the fact they are disarmed?
Point is fairly straightforward; the concept of “gun control” occupies a sliding political scale or spectrum – simply controlling proliferation of guns, in a civil society, tends to improve general societal safety, and does not necessarily mean a prelude to some tyrannical takeover. In a post-enlightment society, much “gun control” is internalised. And sometimes (perhaps often) along with a strong internalised determination to not let one’s country go down without a ferocious fight. But that doesn’t mean that an appropriate level of “gun control” within a society is wrong, or weak, or a symptom of apathy or somesuch, just an understanding that generally, the civil society is better off for it. And yes, Australian society is [obviously] not ‘killing the citizens despite that fact that they are [generally speaking] disarmed’.
How did you arrive at that conclusion? Is it a feeling or a sentiment you have, or do you have some evidence to support your claim?
I thought that’s what you were suggesting. What logical connection does it have to Steve’s point?
German society was one of the most civil societies on Earth before it stopped being so and the government decided to kill millions of the country’s citizens. Now, German society is again one of the most civil on Earth.
The Turkish government did not kill many Armenians until it decided to kill them all.
Life in the Soviet Union and the Communist Eastern Block looked very civil most of the time. Do you think it was?
Do I need to go on?
And last but not least, would you like to elaborate on your “post-enlightment society” and “internalised gun control” lingo? What is “enlightment” anyway? What the heck are you talking about?
Guns are so 19th century.
“In a post-enlightment society, much “gun control” is internalised.”
Australia exists at the protection of Great Britain and the United States. Australia has disarmed. They depend on Obama for their survival. That should scare the living **** out of them. They are naked as a jaybird with India and China jockeying for control of the Indian Ocean. Australia will not exist 20 years from now, maybe not 15, but as the colony of an Asian power. Decadence will swallow another country.
GEE, Australian seems to think they have a real problem with their gun control laws.
I can not find the link I was looking for from a few years ago but the news has this:
Of course since this is a PROGRESSIVE news source the suggestion is “to call for judges to impose tougher sentences for gun crime”
Ban guns ===> MORE gun crimes
This is what historical evidence has been saying for years but no, they can’t let go of their Utopian Vision. They are bound and determined to MAKE reality fit their preconceived ideas. This is straight Marxist Philosophy at work. All they need is ruby slippers to make their wishes into reality. Since they do not have the ruby slippers they use more and more laws and regulations.
These people can not reason their way out of a paper bag. I have a herd of sheep with more reasoning ability!
Here is the
* Innocent people are being caught up in gun battles.
Sound like Mexico; is this what Australia is turning into?
(‘guns’ are banned in Mexico, too)
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Unless something has changed recently only military calibers are banned in Mexico, although licensing is corrupt and restrictive. Non-citizens are under a full ban.
Mexican ‘gun ownership’ laws are really screwy, effectively banning all guns in the hands of citizens where they do the most good, which is in a holster on a hip … or on the chest under a ‘jacket’ … check out out what their constitution used to allow, compared to the re-writes since the first one which allowed firearms …
From the department of unintended consequences (country bans guns, cops go crooked, drug cartels run rampant over the citizenry):
The Rise of Mexico’s Self-Defense Forces
Vigilante Justice South of the Border
Excerpt:
On a Tuesday morning in March, with rifles slung over their shoulders, some 1,500 men filed into the Mexican town of Tierra Colorada, which sits on the highway from Mexico City down to the Pacific coast. They seized at gunpoint 12 police officers and a local security official, whom they believed responsible for the murder of their commander. They set up roadblocks, and when a car of Acapulco-bound beachgoers refused to stop, they opened fire and injured a passenger.
This was not the work of a drug cartel. The men were members of a self-defense group, one of a growing number of vigilante organizations aiming to restore order to Mexican communities. “We have besieged the municipality,” said a spokesperson for the group, “because here criminals operate with impunity in broad daylight.”
Mexico has suffered staggering levels of violence and crime during the country’s seven-year-long war against the cartels. The fighting has killed 90,000 people so far, a death toll larger, as of this writing, than that of the civil war in Syria. Homicide rates have tripled since 2007. In an effort to stem the carnage, Mexican President Enrique Peña Nieto announced last December that the federal government, having struggled to defeat the cartels using corrupt local police and an inadequate military, would create an elite national police force of 10,000 officers by the end of this year.
– – – – –
More – see link above.
.
+1
Any wonder that the Mexicans come to the USA to stay?
Another problem for Mexico was NAFTA.
I’ve read good things about the Mexican self-defense forces but I’m afraid Neville would find their use of guns incompatible with civil society and counsel they’d be better off without them. He would say that the Mexican “post-enlightment” society has not yet “internalised an appropriate level of gun control”.
—–
Why can’t I stop thinking about Peace for Our Time?
Or “Peace in our time” even …
Maybe even that, somewhere.
The statement “My good friends this is the second time in our history that there has come back from Germany to Downing Street peace with honor. I believe it is peace in our time. …” seems to have been delivered when he was in front of 10 Downing Street following his reading of the ‘signed agreement’ reached with H!tler. Accounts are found in the book “The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich”. The newsreels, I think, only show him reading the agreement on the tarmac after he exited the aircraft on which he flew back from Germany … .
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Yes. If I remember right, he read the Anglo-German memorandum on the tarmac—after some initial remarks—and that’s on the infamous newsreel with people cheering.
Later that day he read it again at Downing Street and added the paragraph with the “peace for our time” phrase.
http://www.britannia.com/history/docs/peacetime.html
The front page of the Daily Sketch, 1 October 1938:
http://www.bl.uk/onlinegallery/features/frontpage/peace.html
Gail,
While you make a good point about gun control not controlling criminals, the quote you choose to focus you derision on is actually a good idea …
“to call for judges to impose tougher sentences for gun crime”
Gun laws do not affect criminals as has been pointed out on many occassions on this blog. However, it is a good idea to add years to a sentence to any convicted criminal that uses a gun in the execution of a crime. That is the only possible measure that has any chance of modifying a criminals behaviour.
“However, it is a good idea to add years to a sentence to any convicted criminal that uses a gun in the execution of a crime. That is the only possible measure that has any chance of modifying a criminals behaviour.”
No. Armed robbery should be dealt with as armed robbery. You obsess about guns.
This is a common sense idea agreed to by all. Just ask people who had been stabbed through the kidneys with a screwdriver, then beaten with a hammer and left for dead in the shop, had a brother beaten to death with baseball bats or had family members tied down and burned alive with the house by criminals disposing of evidence.
They all say that guns would make such situations more dangerous and must be discouraged in favor of more appropriate tools.
You really should ascertain the facts of your argument, before making said argument.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2974487/posts
Crime in Australia has nearly doubled since the “gun ban”; I put it in quotes because in reality guns are banned only for potential victims–criminals inconveniently ignore the ban. In fact, they relish it–for now they can be certain their victims cannot fight back effectively.
Same story in England. In fact England’s statistics are soul-crushingly dismal–unlike peaceful, low-crime Texas where I live, England’s per-capita rate of violent crime is eight times higher.
So the clock’s ticking for Australia and England. Their governments haven’t yet decided on their particular Final Solution, but while they ruminate the criminals have free reign.
I laughed when Piers Morgan kept asking Alex Jones how many GUN murders there were in England…surely a low number. But it struck me as funny because I immediately imagined visitors at the Pearly Gates seeing an officious St. Peter collecting “how’d you die?” statistics, and English visitors wiping their brows…”Phew! I was killed with a KNIFE, you know, and feel ever so much better!”
I also point out the difference between control of guns in a civil society, and use of guns to defend one’s country.
If you have a civil society you do not NEED gun control legislation.
The Swiss proved that years ago.
Again, what is your point? After confiscation and mass destruction of guns in Australia violent crimes against its citizens actually have gone up, espencially robbery and home invasions. So the government is still benevolent? It still causes the deaths of its citizens by not protecting them from criminals and by not allowing them to protect themselves.
+1
Your definition of a ‘civil society’ does not included the right to defend oneself?
Should I presume to say that in your ‘civil society’ crimainal actions don’t happen, disputes between individuals and families can’t happen, violent outsiders can never arrive to cause mayhem?
Or does everyone live happily ever after?
Affirmative. Self-defense is an outdated concept that will be eliminated in a fully-developed classless society as crime will disappear.
Oh I see, so once everyone is employed they’ll be no murders.
Ummm, nice theory.
Tell Joe that Kim Jong-un says the people of North Korea approve of his message.
I’d pass it on but I’m hearing the story just got more complicated. You see, Marxist scholars assumed until now that widespread famines, cannibalism and eating one’s own earwax in Communist societies is just a necessary but temporary condition in the class struggle against the bourgeoisie.
But a new theory proposes that eating one’s own earwax is the necessary pre-condition for Progressives who aspire to overcome the corrupt mindset and social norms of the bourgeoisie and develop their revolutionary consciousness.
Congressman Garcia, not Kim Jong-un, may be the true vanguard of the movement:
http://time.com/99049/congressman-eats-earwax-on-cspan
And this guy is from FLORIDA??? Home of the drug trafficers?
Perhaps we should send him to Mexico or Columbia for a few years, with just the shirt on his back, to ‘Enlighten him’
Translation for readers not familiar with the Progressive vocabulary (not you Tom and Gail):
Congressman Garcia doesn’t give a rat’s ass what Kim Jong-un thinks. These guys have egos.
More guns less crime. I’m not going to break into my neighbors house because she packs a .44 mag. Really.
Darn right.
After several frustrating years trying to get our local drug pusher/thief in jail (And yes I knew who it was and had witnesses and plenty of evidence, however the local drug lords OWNED the cops.) I finally used a 22. I have not had any more theft or dead animals – AMAZING {:>D
Actually, yes. Car jacking and home invasions have fallen drastically in Arizona since the state gave citizens more freedom to protect themselves. Most violent crimes involve the illegal alien slave trade and drug gangs, all sponsored by the drug cartels.
http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2014/05/27/emma-watson-sat-next-to-armed-guard-at-brown-university-graduation-ceremony/?intcmp=features
“A Brown University rep says he is unable to answer questions about why Emma Watson had an undercover armed guard with her during graduation ceremonies.”
You see Emma Watson doen’t need to have a gun.
Yes she does.
Hers just has a live body attached to it.
Here in the UK, Tony Bliar banned handguns in the wake of the March1996 Dunblane massacre of 16 Scottish primary school children, & their teacher.
By 2009, gun crime had almost doubled, & deaths were up 104% :
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1223193/culture-violence-gun-crime-goes-89-decade.html
2013, Slimy Tony’s daughter is held at gunpoint in an attempted mugging.
July, 2013, Lo & Behold, crime figures are way down! The cops are under pressure to cook the books.
http://www.ukcolumn.org & go to the article with the cops in high-viz yellow jackets. “It’s not a crime unless you get caught.”
Jan, 2014, Nigel Farage is dismissed as Blundering, crazy talking, when he wants the gun ban repealed : http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/nigel-farage-calls-end-gun-3058380
At first, the slimy bliar said the ban was about the crime figures. When these rocketed, he said it was about the gang culture. When this got worse, he said….nowt.
OH how I would dearly love to see this grinning murderer in the dock, for crimes against Humanity.
He had his best year ever, last year. He earned £13 million, not bad for a Labour man.
Almost £10 quid per dead Iraqi.
He was on our TV recently, rubbishing Farage. Not a word on policy, just meaningless invective.
Last Thursday, Farage trounced Labour & Tory in the European elections.
First time in over 100 years a National election has not been won by one of the two major parties.
I had a very satisfying pint or three.
You cannot fool all the people, all the time, & the wind is shifting.
Congratulations on the UKIP and Farage win.
Fabian Tony Blair is certainly interesting, especially since he was supposed to be a ‘Friend’ of Gadhafi.
Here are bits and pieces of news stories that add up to a very nasty whole. Blair has enough blood on his hand as you suggested and it is not just the blood of dead Iraqi.
“Former UK PM, Tony Blair a UK Fabian Society leader is appointed Middle East envoy working on behalf of the US, Russia, the UN and the EU….” http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/6244358.stm
Blair is also in the pay of the bankers:
“Jan 28, 2008 … Tony Blair will be paid £2.5m a year for his post at US investment bank JP Morgan, it was revealed today. (wwwDOT)dailymail.co.uk/news/article-508157/Tony-Blairs-time-bank-job-make-times-expected.html
I do not think it was a coincidence that a FABIAN SOCIETY PHAMPHLET: “From Dictator to Democracy” was spotted several times in Egypt.:
(wwwDOT)politicsdaily.com/2011/02/25/after-egypt-and-libya-whats-next-for-those-still-under-dictato/
Who has free e-books including Gene Sharp’s “From Dictatorship to Democracy?”
Fabian Essays In Socialism: (wwwDOT)bestebooksworld.com/ebook/16953/
So one wonders exactly WHAT Blair was doing to earn that £2.5m a year from J.P. Morgan.
This story may have the answer: Gadhafi’s Gold-money Plan Would Have Devastated Dollar
Do not forget that Gadhafi’s son was going to the Fabian founded London School of Economics (thanks to Tony Blair) and I am certain was interested in Economics (or at least his father was.) So what would be the talk of the campus???
In Sept. 15, 2010 “A Bill to Fight Crony Capitalism” (Wall Street Journal – Opinion Europe section) “The radical reform that would end boom and bust in banking,” (Telegraph.co.uk.) The basic ideas behind the proposed bill are influenced by the work of the Austrian economist Huerta de Soto and Austrian economists were invited to make presentations before Parliament. This would not make the Central bankers happy.
With that as background, here are some snippets from the story.
What is interesting is the BRICS countries are doing the exact same thing as Gadhafi was. Stock piling gold and forming an international bank that challenges the World Bank and IMF….
China and Russia have been unhappy with the US dollar as world reserve currency ever since The Bernanke started inflating the heck out of it in 2008. This may also be the explanation behind the escalation of hostilities in the Crimea.
BRICS countries = Brazil, Russia, India, China, South America
Not that different from Sadam selling oil to the Chinese (and legally getting around UN/US sanctions) and getting paid in Euros/gold, before a war started. He also went from darling of the West to demon. But then Sadam knew too much about the Iran-Contra/Oliver North fiasco.
Amazing how the “News” we are fed by the MSM has zero to do with the reality of the situation but if you do some digging you can sometimes find bits and pieces that shed a bit of light.
One of the more intriguing cover-ups is the true story about the massacre of the ‘youth summer’ camp in Norway. Turns out it was a camp for young politician hopefuls and a little bit of leaking indicated it was not just for young members of Norway’s socialist governing party but for young up and coming types from all over the world.
More interesting is the fact the gunman waited around to ‘Deliver a Message’ but I really doubt we will ever know what that message really was. Of course the MSM has to make it look like a crazy shooting up a kiddie camp but one does wonder….
After the Workers’ Youth League (AUF) shooting it is noteworthy to see during that time the Norway/Denmark/Sweden clean-up of groups that were supposedly similar to Anders Behring Breivik’s group that he rarely (if ever) met with.
The part that does not make sense is that if he is mad, or worse, what damage can his Facebook account and his 1,500-page manifesto do? Nothing? Where is it now?
As the BBC report says
Or is that the ‘safe’ version, the one to keep you quiet?
So you smelled something fishy with the MSM version of events too.
Of course it also depends on your definition of “Crazy” The soviet Union had there definition and now CAGW pushers like Lewandowsky are trying to come up with a new definition.
“I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them.” –George Mason, Speech During Virginia’s Convention to Ratify the Constitution, 1788