McCain and Graham Assail Colleague’s Filibuster Over Drones – NYTimes.com
*John McCain got Obama into the White House, by running the most incompetent presidential campaign in US history.
Disrupting the Borg is expensive and time consuming!
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I have already contacted McCain’s and Graham’s offices, asking them to please step aside and allow real men, free men, to represent real Americans.
I also dropped a ‘note’ of gratitude for Sen Paul.
Live free or die.
Paul is right in principal, but in the real world, where one man with a “dirty” weapon can take out a million Americans, it might be a necessary evil. Too bad the man at the top making these decisions isn’t more trustworthy.
– Benjamin Franklin
So you are willing to be the one eating at the Dairy Queen next door to the hell-fire missile target? … after all, just a little collateral damage.
How about a police roadblock?
I can think of a thousands reasons why this is a bad idea, and that is without even having my morning coffee… but there is one overwhelming reason that stands out above all others. This is: “Clear, Premeditated Intent To Assassinate” … New flash for the folks out there that try to justify this. The one undeniable thing that sets this apart from everything else is that it is premeditated assassination, which is illegal, unconstitutional and very dangerous, in anyone’s hands.
And for the progressive/Marxists out there, how are you going to feel when at some point it is no longer “your guy” that has his finger on the trigger? “Your Guy” can’t be there forever…
And never mind the “oops, wrong guy”.
Remember how the LAPD put over 30 rounds into a pickup truck with 2 Asian women, because they looked so much like the 270 pound black man they were looking for? Do you really want the same people able to fly drones around shooting at people too?
I know, you are thinking “we’re not talking about LAPD flying drones”. No, it will begin with just some Xbox gaming geek ordered by some equally unknown bureaucrat thousands of miles away. Eventually it will evolve, as all things do, where it will be the same LAPD that shot up a pickup truck with 2 Asian women, that looked so much like a 270 black man.
This is a road you cannot turn around on.
Excellent points, squid. The unelected bureaucrats placed in charge of instituting and overseeing the drone program will be the first to hire all of the drugged-up Adam Lanzas produced by today’s public educators/counselors as their “targeters.” Training requirements: computer and Xbox capabilities, willing to spend long hours sequestered in a secret hiding place (like mommie’s basement).
exactly! All for a box of Hot Pockets and Red Bull
That’s one way of looking at it, Andy. But we’re trying to take a noble stand here. Against the abuse of govt power. Don’t rain on our parade! Look, if we were really in that sort of danger by a nuke or something I’m sure the authorities would take action. But lets not give O constitutional carte blanche to start drone attacks on whomever.
The scenario is absurd. You don’t want to blow up a dirty bomb with a missile for obvious reasons. If they know where the person is, they can apprehend him.
Exactly Steve! For all the supposed “legitimate” reasons I have heard given why you would want or “need” this sort of authority, they are all situations where you absolutely not utilize this mechanism. Yours but one perfect example. Even if you had the authority, you would never use it to try and take out something like a dirty bomb.
The only reason why you would have such authority is to specifically assassinate. A drone can only be used for two things, either recon or assassination. There is no other possible application. I have little problem with recon myself. If they wish to watch me hit golf balls in my backyard, more power to them. But, you cannot call a drone strike for any other purpose than premeditated assassination. This is illegal on many inescapable fronts. It is the ultimate dictators tool.
Sen. Paul admitted that there are exceptions wherein it is most probable and even desirable that an actual imminent threat would be summarily shot, blown up or otherwise fatally disposed of.
And we all understand that there are places ( pakistan) where swat teams and FBI agents are not allowed to go.
Unfortunately ( and stupidly) I heard Sen. Graham use the example of the Nazi Saboteurs arrested in WWII.
They had explosives. They were dangerous. Domestic Law enforcement and trials ensued for those foreign terrorists and their domestic contacts.
Whatever point he thought he was making , I did not get it.
IMHO, in this regard, Rand Paul is a fool. There is no acceptable justification for such an operation. Any ordered drone strike is a premeditated assassination. There is absolutely no other way to spin it, I don’t care what the circumstances are. A drone strike ensures no possible reprehension, it can only recon or kill.
Squid,
There are times.
Active shooter. Shoot him.
Other clear cut examples were offered.
I am not in favor of drone strikes on US soil and citizens.
I think even the overseas operations could backfire.
But there are times when action is demanded.
Once they do the first one, it will become routine police action. Consider Christopher Droner a few weeks ago. LAPD would have exploded every pickup truck they could.see.
The sick part is that the same people who told us that miranda extended to Afghanistan, and that terrorists apprehended on the “field of battle” such as it is, in foreign lands, should be tried in NYC, now want a license to kill, at home, with zero oversight .
These are some unprincipled individuals.
“Once they do the first one, it will become routine police action. Consider Christopher Droner a few weeks ago. LAPD would have exploded every pickup truck they could.see.”
I do tend to agree. Slippery slope and all that.
And it would be LAPD.
Just don’t drip water on their faces, right John?
Crazy old coot. He wonders why he lost.
I am just blown away right now to see the very same people that were going bat-shit crazy over water-boarding, are now the very same people that are in support of vaporizing people, without due process, without detainment, without representation… Truly remarkable indeed.
And all of this with no consideration for collateral damage… we now officially live in bizarroworld .. someone call Seinfeld!
Squid – You are right on. i cannot even come up with anything representing a rational explantation for this kind of BS. We are truly falling into an abyss completely lacking in any logic or critical thinking skills that has taken hold of our society.
By their definition, I am a potential threat. I am considered an ‘extremist’ for wanting to preserve my rights. And in this interconnected web of a world we have designed, at what point are my activities seen as a threat? How soon should they preempt?
I don’t expect a Hellfire missile to come knocking. But who will come knocking, and how many of my rights will be gone by the time they do?
*John McCain got Obama into the White House, by running the most incompetent presidential campaign in US history
And your post demonstrates the complete identity in policy between them
Someone, a human is controlling the drone. He and the team with him are liable for the destruction they inflict on people. I can’t imagine a coherent legal argument for using drones can be made outside a National Emergency being called.
How can ‘due process’ work when the controller of a drone is kept behind a shield of government departments shrouded in bureaucratic walls of stifling legalese argument?
Just asking…
John McCain, War Hero, endured a Vietnamese prison camp.
A lot of Americans endured prison camps and the last thing they do is affirm the right for self-appointed despots to murder their own countrymen at their pleasure
gator69 says:
March 7, 2013 at 7:48 pm
By their definition, I am a potential threat
——————————————————
Yes Sir, I think the O admin has classified ex military as some of the worst potential terrorist, as well as many patriot groups; whos numbers, like bullet and gun sales, have grown more then ever because of Obama.
Does anyone have a comprehensive list of how many people and armaments are now part of HLS
Exactly, along with anyone having, or suspected of having a “Tea Party” or “right wing” label… how convenient for them. It is the ultimate dictators tool, this is why Obama wants it. He has completed his field testing abroad, and now it is time for hometown implementation. Mark my words, you will hear about this for as long as he is in office. He will make every attempt possible to get this authority, even by fiat if necessary.
Oh, to answer your question. I believe Steve posted something close the other day. Let’s see if I can regurgitate from memory:
* 2,700 light armored vehicles (just added)
* 7,000 automatic weapons (just added)
* 1.7 billion rounds of ammunition (just added)
* 120,000 agents
Going along to get along is the equivalent of murdering your children!
Thanks, and I note the just addded, but what of past purchases also. Thanks again. Also, I did not know Tea Party members were mentioned in any white papers or other corresondence. Does anyone have a link.